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Posted by jIM on June 6, 2008, 5:03 am
I am considering a career change to accounting and financial planning.
I am looking at taking a CFP prep course such as:
http://www.xavierconsulting.com/cfp.html
Question- would taking a course like this without a business degree be
a waste of money?
I have a BS in Mechnical Engineering, but my knowledge of economics is
probably not what a business major would have.
If taking a course like above is not a good idea, I am considering any
of the following options to improve business knowledge (to pass the
CFP exam):
1) Get an MBA with a concentration in finance or something similar
2) Get an associates degree in business or accounting to get the
skills needed.
3) Work part time for an accounting firm during tax season to learn on
the job, then take a review course.
Are their any certifications or licenses needed to prepare tax returns
for other people? Are those licenses easier or more difficult than
the CFP (as far as education and background knowledge needed).
Thank you.
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Posted by kastnna on June 6, 2008, 11:55 am
> I am looking at taking a CFP prep course such
as:http://www.xavierconsulting.com/cfp.html
I used the University of Georgia's program and one of my fellow
employees attended the American College. We both were pleased with the
programs offered. I can't speak for Xavier.
> Question- would taking a course like this without a business degree be
> a waste of money?
I don't think my business degree aided too much in my CFP
certification. On the other hand, I feel my economics degree helped.
IMO, the finance courses (required by my econ degree) were the most
valuable of all. If you can't run a _financial_ caluculator backwards
and forwards, the CFP exam is going to be an uphill battle. But I
suspect with enough extra effort, almost anyone with the ability to
pass an accredited college can grasp the basics.
> If taking a course like above is not a good idea, I am considering any
> of the following options to improve business knowledge (to pass the
> CFP exam):
For the record, you do know that you _must_ eventually take a course
like the one above, right? You cannot sit for the CFP exam until
completing the education requirement as offered by an accredited
institution.
Have you looked at: http://www.cfp.net/become/Steps.asp
> 1) Get an MBA with a concentration in finance or something similar
> 2) Get an associates degree in business or accounting to get the
> skills needed.
> 3) Work part time for an accounting firm during tax season to learn on
> the job, then take a review course.
You may want to engage in a couple of these options, not just one.
Number #1 may be overkill. Obviously, #2 would help. As for #3, both
the CPA and CFP deisgnations require documented experience working
directly in the respective field (I don't know about the EA
designation). The CFP, frex, requires 3 years of full time experience
under a "mentor" that is qualified to provide at least one of the six
aspects of certified financial planning. Even if you work full-time,
you are only credited for the time specifically spent doing financial
planning. In reality, the CFP board will take you on your word, but
they have been known to audit mentors to assure CFP applicants are not
exaggerating their duties.
> Are their any certifications or licenses needed to prepare tax returns
> for other people? Are those licenses easier or more difficult than
> the CFP (as far as education and background knowledge needed).
A word of warning: the CFP, enrolled agent's, and the CPA exams are
all very difficult in their own right. I recently looked into both of
the "accounting" designations and found I simply didn't have the time
to invest. Even with both of my business degrees, I still didn't have
the requisite accounting classes to even take the CPA courses. I've
been told that a BS in accounting doesn't even cover the
prerequisites. Also, both tax programs seemed very detail oriented.
Opposingly, the CFP was difficult because it covers such a wide scope.
It's detailed, but not so much so as the tax designations. Taxation
only comprises 1/6th of the CFP exam, but again the knowledge required
doesn't rival that of a CPA.
Lastly, I think I recently read the national pass rate for the CFP is
about 60% on the first try. Keep that in mind. The jobs are not the
cake-walks some make them out to be. Obviously, a large number of
applicants find that out when they go to take the test. It's a great
field with great potential, but if you're looking for quick riches,
look somewhere else.
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Posted by jIM on June 9, 2008, 1:08 pm
, both
> the CPA and CFP deisgnations require documented experience working
> directly in the respective field (I don't know about the EA
> designation). The CFP, frex, requires 3 years of full time experience
> under a "mentor" that is qualified to provide at least one of the six
> aspects of certified financial planning. Even if you work full-time,
> you are only credited for the time specifically spent doing financial
> planning. In reality, the CFP board will take you on your word, but
> they have been known to audit mentors to assure CFP applicants are not
> exaggerating their duties.
According to further comments based on e-mails I made, the 3 years
experience can be obtained after passing the exam (3 years experience
needed 10 years before exam or 5 years after exam).
>
> > Are their any certifications or licenses needed to prepare tax returns
> > for other people? Are those licenses easier or more difficult than
> > the CFP (as far as education and background knowledge needed).
The CFP prep course has a module on taxation which I am told is good
enough to get started (get employment) in a tax related field.
I appreciate the responses on this board and thru private e-mail.
Thank you.
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Posted by kastnna on June 9, 2008, 3:30 pm
> , both
>
> > the CPA and CFP deisgnations require documented experience working
> > directly in the respective field (I don't know about the EA
> > designation). The CFP, frex, requires 3 years of full time experience
> > under a "mentor" that is qualified to provide at least one of the six
> > aspects of certified financial planning. Even if you work full-time,
> > you are only credited for the time specifically spent doing financial
> > planning. In reality, the CFP board will take you on your word, but
> > they have been known to audit mentors to assure CFP applicants are not
> > exaggerating their duties.
>
> According to further comments based on e-mails I made, the 3 years
> experience can be obtained after passing the exam (3 years experience
> needed 10 years before exam or 5 years after exam).
Yes, that's true. The CFP board may also grant a one-time 3 year
extension (determined on a case by case basis).
It seems awfully risky to obtain the experience after the fact (and
potentially expensive). 3 full time years out of 5 doesn't leave much
wiggle room. What if you can only find part-time employment in the
field? What if 50% of your duties are administrative and don't count
towards "experience"? What if you're terminated (I hope not, though)?
Perhaps, the question to ask is "WHY get the CFP certification first"?
What's the expected benefit? A) One cannot use the CFP designation or
market themselves as a certificant unless they have completed ALL the
reqs (no experience = no title); B) It's expensive and most firms will
pay for it or reimburse you; C) You may discover you don't like the
industry; D) you're unlikely to get the kind of job a CFP would
warrant due to your lack of experience; E) you needlessly create a
narrow time window to complete your reqs; and F) your continuing
education (which is an expense) begins to accrue as soon as you pass
the exam.
Our field is one that puts a great emphasis on experience. I don't
suspect my firm would give anyone a position doing 100% CFP-related
work unless they had some experience under their belt (especially
meeting with clients). I get the feeling (possibly errantly) that you
are looking for a way to skip the "entry-level" position. My
experience suggest that you aren't going to accomplish that just
because you passed the CFP exam.
Good luck in whatever you decide!
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to keep the conversations on-topic for financial planning. Other posting
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Posted by on June 6, 2008, 6:20 pm
> jIM wrote:
> > I am considering a career change to accounting and financial
> > planning. Are their any certifications or licenses needed to
> > prepare tax returns for other people? Are those licenses easier
> > or more difficult than the CFP (as far as education and background
> > knowledge needed).
>
> The CFP coursework would be a good start for an overview of all the
> topical areas. But keep in mind that "CFP" is a trademark, not a
> license to practice, and it isn't required to work in financial
> planning.
However, in most (all?) states, to register as an investment
advisor (or, more specifically, as an investment advisor rep),
one may have to take and pass the Series 65 exam. A CFP
licensee is usually exempted from having to take the 65.
<http://www.nasaa.org/industry___regulatory_resources/investment_advisers/445.cfm#1>
[snip - some great comments about tax work]
--
Plain Bread alone for e-mail, thanks. The rest gets trashed.
No HTML in E-Mail! -- http://www.expita.com/nomime.html
Are you posting responses that are easy for others to follow?
http://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/2000/06/14/quoting
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Misc.invest.financial-plan is a moderated newsgroup where Moderators strive
to keep the conversations on-topic for financial planning. Other posting
guidelines include a request for brevity and another for trimming posts to
which we respond. For all of the other tips and suggestions, see "FROM THE
MODERATORS: Posting to misc.invest.financial-plan", a weekly post now on the
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